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Vec, how exactly are people "born into" it? Even if they were raised in a particular faith, it's up to them whether to stay or go. I was raised anglican, that doesn't make me conform to it. My point was more so about your distinction between the "leaders" and the "followers"; by remaining followers, they're encouraging the leaders to keep going down the path they're going.

As for Coyote comparing compulsory schooling to the church in terms of being a "propaganda point"; if you had said that to me a few years ago I don't know how I'd have reacted to such a comparison, but I don't think I'd have liked it. That said, I'm not as inclined to disagree now as I would've been then. There's a difference between education and indoctrination, but then again, schools can somewhat blur the lines sometimes, such as with their "education" in terms of illegal drugs like marijuana, for example; those aspects could use some fixing. But I think it's a somewhat weak analogy; schools are secular, or at least are supposed to be, and at least they teach about different religions in the world, etc. as different cultures, whereas the pamphlets churches give to little kids refute doubts like "what about other religions, what if they're right?" with blatant scare-tactics like "these are just doubts the devil fills your mind with"; it's completely manipulative, whereas at least the supposed goal of public education is to, well, educate people. In hindsight, I'm not so sure now if I trust their approach either.

And natw, you talk about the circumstances of the abortion, but I can't help but think you're missing Coyote's point; if it's their church, it's up to them what their standards are, regardless of their reasons. Those who don't like it don't have to be members. You ask about if "god" would want one of "his" creations to die a slow and painful death, but really, who gets to say what "god" wants? Isn't it rather presumptuous to begin with? And if a particular church has a certain stance on that, and certain people don't like that stance, then what are those people doing in that church?